I am being criticized for my criticisms of capitalism on the ridiculous grounds that I live in a capitalist society. It's a bizarre criticism, but I have faced it before.
The basic argument is that because I buy things I support capitalism. I don't know why those who make this argument do not immediately recognize how completely absurd it is.
True, I support capitalism in a material sense when I buy things, but that's not support in the sense that I promote capitalism or that I have a desire that it succeed. I support capitalism materially because I am forced to. I live in a capitalist society by misfortune of birth. I didn't choose it.
Slaves supported the system of slavery on these grounds, since their labor is what made the system of slavery possible. Slaves accepted food, housing, medicine, indeed everything from the slave owner. They had to. They had no choice. It's called surviving.
Likewise, I have no choice under capitalism but to buy food and medicine, pay rent, and so forth. This reality of the situation is in fact one of the central reason why capitalism and every other exploitative system is wrong.
If I were forced to contribute my labor to a society in which the workers owned and controlled the means of production, that would be one thing. Every society in history has required those who could work to work for the betterment of the community. "From each according to his ability to each according to his need." I would even settle for "From each according to his ability to each according to his contribution," with some social provision for those who cannot produce enough for themselves, of course (you know, children, the disabled, the elderly).
But under capitalism, I am forced to contribute my labor to, and obtain necessary items from a class of non-workers who monopolize the means of production. Capitalism is in essence a system in which people who don't work live of the labor of those who do - and they live even better than the producers do.
Being forced to contribute to such an unjust arrangement is what's wrong with capitalism.
It isn't supporting capitalism to be forced to live in it any more than prisoners support prisons.
Frankly, I would be embarrassed to have made such a stupid argument.
The basic argument is that because I buy things I support capitalism. I don't know why those who make this argument do not immediately recognize how completely absurd it is.
True, I support capitalism in a material sense when I buy things, but that's not support in the sense that I promote capitalism or that I have a desire that it succeed. I support capitalism materially because I am forced to. I live in a capitalist society by misfortune of birth. I didn't choose it.
Slaves supported the system of slavery on these grounds, since their labor is what made the system of slavery possible. Slaves accepted food, housing, medicine, indeed everything from the slave owner. They had to. They had no choice. It's called surviving.
Likewise, I have no choice under capitalism but to buy food and medicine, pay rent, and so forth. This reality of the situation is in fact one of the central reason why capitalism and every other exploitative system is wrong.
If I were forced to contribute my labor to a society in which the workers owned and controlled the means of production, that would be one thing. Every society in history has required those who could work to work for the betterment of the community. "From each according to his ability to each according to his need." I would even settle for "From each according to his ability to each according to his contribution," with some social provision for those who cannot produce enough for themselves, of course (you know, children, the disabled, the elderly).
But under capitalism, I am forced to contribute my labor to, and obtain necessary items from a class of non-workers who monopolize the means of production. Capitalism is in essence a system in which people who don't work live of the labor of those who do - and they live even better than the producers do.
Being forced to contribute to such an unjust arrangement is what's wrong with capitalism.
It isn't supporting capitalism to be forced to live in it any more than prisoners support prisons.
Frankly, I would be embarrassed to have made such a stupid argument.
13 comments:
Are you really trying to make a comparison of someone who is a captive and subject to beating or death for actions contrary to their captive's wishes to that of an individual in a free market economy who has free will? Where they may choose to be a farmer, a doctor, a carpenter, or any of thousands of other options? They may simply work for themselves. (That's called being self-employed, you probably wouldn't understand. ) Your comparison is absurd.
If the communism thing has worked so well in places like Cuba why are so many poor souls floating in tires to get here? How is it working out in the U.S.S.R. and East Germany? Oh wait.. those nations collapsed. How sad.
And if you were so misfortunate as to be born into this evil, capitalist county ( It's actually free market, you could open a fruit stand tomorrow ) a simple plane ticket to Havana will solve your problem. Of course there, if you criticize the system, Castro could have you killed. That could be a flaw in the system.
You're the master of dumb argument, Anon. Nobody in the United States has a choice but to be born in a country in which capitalists rule. Everybody is forced to materially support capitalism. People can't choose to be whatever they want. That's a fairytale. You prefer ideology over the reality of social class, racism, and sexism. The analogy I gave is completely valid and utterly devastating to your argument. You can't recover from this.
So you move to the tired old "people are fleeing Cuba to come here" argument, even misrepresenting Cuba as a communist society.
First, the people who fled Cuba after Castro came to power were the wealthy Cubans who were no longer able to exploit the labor of the Cuban working class, so they came here to set up shop in South Florida. Those who remained in Cuba periodically leave to go live with their rich relatives in Cuba. Good riddance is the position of most Cubans, who are, by the way, wildly enthusiastic about their form of society.
Second, Cuba is an open society. You can criticize the government there. People found around the world freely travel there and return safely home. In fact, it is the US government that has prevented people from traveling to Cuba. US citizens are not free to travel wherever they wish. Ironic, no?
Third, Cuba is not a communist country. Neither was the Soviet Union.
It's always important to know what you are talking about, Anon, before you start talking.
First. People can't choose to be whatever they want? You've got a poor black kid from a broken home who's the president of the United States and a poor Hispanic woman that was just confirmed a Supreme Court Justice.
Second. The Cubans I'm talking about fleeing Cuba left YESTERDAY, not 45 years ago.
Cuba IS an open society alright - the Castro brothers are open to killing you if you don't fall in line. ( and I suppose Cubans really enjoying tooling around in those 1959 Desotos that they're still driving )
The Merriam-Webster dictionary makes your statement that the U.S.S.R was communist laughable.
communism: A political doctrine based on Marxian socialism that was the official ideology of the U.S.S.R.
So this is how communist college professors that detest capitalism justify cashing their paychecks gleaned from the capitalistic machine. Look.. honesty is not that hard. You were finally able to admit that you materially support capitalism. Why not go the extra step and admit that no one is holding you hostage and forcing you to support the system you decry? You make yourself ridiculous posting nonsense such as "Cuba isn't communist and neither was the U.S.S.R." I'm almost embarrassed for you.
Do you really want to stand by such statements as "People can't choose to be whatever they want."? Exactly who forced you to be a professor? Who took your free choice in professions away from you?
The facts are pretty basic. While you may sit there and make excuses to yourself, it's obvious to anyone else that if you truly find capitalism so abhorant, you are free to leave this country and find another that suits you better. You choose to stay in this nation because, regardless of your rhetoric, you know that there is no communist country that offers you and your family the opportunities that you have here. There is no communist country that allows free speech and political dissent without reprisal. The 400 political prisoners in Cuba belie your premise that Cuba is an open society. The crushing poverty and oppression that leaves people desperate enough to cobble a few boards together and try to float 90 miles across the ocean shows the truth of communist life.
You would not subject yourself to the life that average Cubans live and you should have the guts to admit it.
Anon gets his socioeconomic definitions from a dictionary. Impressive. Impressive. Do you ever read any other books, Anon? The on-line Merriam-Webster your library?
What does a Hispanic on the Supreme Court have to do with the material fact that people can't be whatever they want?
Under slavery, there were blacks who white folks let to live in the house. So?
Man, make a real argument.
One more thing I'd like to add. If your a slave to the capitalists, then as a tax payer, we are slaves to the government. Can't have it both ways.
First, I never said workers were slaves to the capitalist. The exploitative strategy of capitalism involves both slave labor and wage labor, primarily the latter. If you are a worker you probably aren't a slave. Slaves are owned by capitalists. Workers sell their labor to capitalists. That's a big difference. So right off the bat you should work on getting the basic assumptions correct.
Second, my argument is that I was born into a capitalist society. I did not choose capitalism. Therefore I do not willingly contribute to it by buying products. Moreover, the majority in capitalist society is forced to sell their labor to the capitalists. The system is a coercive system. People don't choose where they are born, hence the magnificient stupidity of the argument I am criticizing.
Third, the government doesn't own the taxpayer. Paying taxes has nothing to do with slavery per se. Your argument makes no rational sense.
Dude publish my shit or fucking die. I know where you live asshole.
"The system is a coercive system."
And communism isn't? LOL
Stopping somebody from killing another person involves coercion. Again, you miss the point. Coercion is not wrong if it's for the right reasons. Capitalism is an exploitative system, therefore its coercive nature is wrong. But my point has to do with the fact that I have no choice but to live under capitalism and the majority have no choice but the work for capitalists. This is structural coercion. It's a fact of the system.
"Coercion is not wrong if it's for the right reasons."
According to whom? That's exactly why capitalism is better, it's better for you if you just go along with it. What's "better" depends on who you ask.
Better is both subjective and objective. It is better for children to have proper nutrition and a safe, stable environment in which to learn. These are objective facts. It is better to have a decent standard of living than it is to live in poverty. Objective. I could go on all day.
That coercion is not always wrong is something you agree with. If somebody comes into your house to take your things, are you going to let them? Or are you going to use coercion to stop them? Stopping people from hurting other people often requires coercion. This is a good thing and you know you agree it is.
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